Tech

User Review: Shimano XTR Di2

By BikeHubCoreAdmin · 106 comments

Since posting my recent acquisition of the new Di2 XTR on another thread, there have been a number of calls for an honest “commoners” review. Hopefully I can do it justice. Here goes…

The price is big, very big. The “budget” version cost in the region of R35k. What is the budget version you may ask? It includes: new XTR 9500 rear cassette (11 speed, which I understand is Shimano’s new standard); an XTR trail crank with 2x on the front; Di2 front derailleur for the 2x; Di2 rear derailleur for the 11 back; Di2 battery; Pro Tharsis XC seatpost specially designed to house the Di2 battery; junction box; Di2 XTR display unit; XTR 9500 compatible chain; Di2 battery charger; single Di2 shifter on the right (I elected not to take the left shifter for the chainring for reasons you will see later); and Di2 wireset. All of these components are advertised as being cutting edge in terms of technology and materials… which of course comes at a premium.

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Display unit/brain

My LBS installed the groupset for me, and did a great job I might add. It looks very clean given that most of the wiring is run internally on my Epic.

The night before picking my bike up from my LBS, with new groupset being installed, I loaded the Windows-based Shimano software and ran through the manual. The whole system looked completely customisable through the Shimano program and I wondered where I would start tinkering first.

I picked my bike up the next afternoon, trembling with excitement. Although it was late in the afternoon and bitterly cold in Jozi, nothing could keep me away from a short 5km test-run along the Spruit.

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Right shifter for the rear derailleur.

Through the display unit (which is the brain of the groupset) 3 settings have been pre-programmed. There is the manual program where you shift the front derailleur yourself using the second shifter (which I decided not to install). The first synchronized setting is S1, which is setup for a faster, more aggressive ride. Basically, what this allows for, is the automated shifting between the large and small chainrings, depending on gear ratios. Mine has been setup to shift from the large to small chainring when trying to shift past the biggest gear on the cassette (gear 1). As the front derailleur shifts the large chainring to the small, it simultaneously shifts two gears up (smaller) on the cassette into 3rd gear. You then have 2 more gears on the small chainring as you move into granny gear. I was initially a little worried about the front and back shifting simultaneously, but it was entirely smooth.

As I picked up the pace, I shifted up the cassette with a simple click of the shifter. The shifter-click is electronic and virtually taps over rather than having to “push” as with mechanical shifting. It was so easy to shift that I sometimes double shifted, a hangover from the habit of mechanical gears. After I became more familiar with the shifter, this happened less and less. When I shifted to gear 7 or so, the S1 setting decided it was time to shift the front from the small to the large chainring. Again, a simultaneous shift between the back and front, and again, completely smooth. From there I simply tapped through to gear 11 as I screamed down a Delta park section.

The only way I could tell I was changing gears was through the display unit that “turns on” with every shift (and then “sleeps” 5 seconds later to save battery power); the clicking of the shifter; the occasional sci-fi “whrr” of the servo; and the change in power to the pedal stroke. The shifting of the chain between gears was inaudible and I couldn’t feel it through the cranks, not in the slightest. Think of gear paddles on a high-end sports car. You tap paddles on the side of the steering wheel to shift up and down gears – the power ratio shifts, but everything else is seamless. You wouldn’t know the difference except for the change in tone of the engine.

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Front derailleur with 2x XTR trail crank

Synchronized setting S2 works similarly, but the gear change ratios are setup more for climbing environments. In other words, the shift down to the small chainring happens earlier in gear 3 or 4, and the shift up to the big chainring occurs later in gear 8 or 9. Of course, settings S1 and S2 are completely customisable, so you can decide when the shift between chainrings occurs depending on your riding style. You can also tap a button at the bottom of the display unit while riding, to move between the settings. I found no reason to move out of the S1 setting.

At first I thought that the manual setting would allow me to change the chainrings from the same shifter that controls the back gears. I understand that this is not the case. If you want the ability to change the front chainrings manually, I am told that you will need the left shifter. I can’t see myself wanting to shift from the automated synchronised settings to manual, and a left shifter will only be a waste of space on the handlebar and money. I can always have a left shifter installed at a later stage if I change my mind, but that would be like installing a manual gearbox in a car next to an automatic gear box… there just in case I felt that an automatic gearbox wasn’t giving me what I needed. Having said that, I am told that some of the pros riding Di2 on the XC World Cup circuit have opted to install the left shifter for that added control. I am not a pro, I don’t need it and don’t want it at this stage.

I returned home after my maiden Di2 voyage and plugged the charger unit into the display unit. On the other end was my laptop with the Shimano software. It took me a bit of time to recognise what component codes relate to what items installed on my bike, until I figured out that the recognition software actually tells you what it picks up. I am not sure why they do not just refer to the components by their commonly known names rather than by codes. I am not sure why it needs my input in the first place, if it can pick up what is there automatically. Anyway, after figuring the components out, I clicked on the customisable features and tinkered with the derailleur settings, as one would with a barrel adjustor, or when setting the high low screws on a derailleur. Although you can do this “in the bush” through the display unit if necessary, it is easier to do with a laptop. After playing around, I returned the settings to the LBS settings that had been set for me. I was satisfied that I could quite easily adjust the derailleurs for perfect settings with the click of a button or two.

The only change that I did make, due to a personal preference, was to reverse the paddles on the shifter, so that the bottom paddle changed up the gears (from large to small cog), and the top paddle changed down the gears (from small to large cog). This too, was as easy a two clicks on the laptop screen.

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Rear derailleur with x11 cassette

The Shimano software will also detect whether the components’ firmware needs to be updated, and automatically update the software when connected to the internet. Pretty similar to how your app store identifies and then updates apps on your iPhone. Quick and painless. I believe that future updates of firmware will allow for greater features to be added to the Di2 system. It already has the option for the electric Fox shock system connection – controlling lockout etc from the display unit. It won’t be long before the shock system will read which gear you are in and adjust the lockout accordingly.

So far, other than the steep price, it’s all extremely positive. Beyond my expectations. But wait, the real clincher for me is yet to be revealed. You know that feeling when you have just bought a new bike, with a great new groupset. Those gears shift so smoothly. Jump forward a year and some long tough rides later with a fall here and there – the cables gather dirt, sometimes crimp, stretch a little with time and use. You can fiddle with the derailleur settings all you want, but you can’t quite replicate the smooth gear changes you experienced when the groupset was new. Move forward another year and you develop a bit of chainrub here and there. The “solution” is often a cleaning or replacement of the cables. But let’s be honest, how many of us want that effort. We often clank along until it becomes unbearable and then deliver our bikes to our LBS with a strict instruction to “make it like new again”. In my experience, and no matter what the LBS does, it is never as clean and smooth as it was when it was new. If the Di2 myth is to be believed, that disappointment is a thing of the past.

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Pro Tharsis XC seatpost which houses the battery

Because the gears are shifted through a servo, rather than cables that suffer from dirt and fatigue, the system is designed to stay as smooth and crisp as when it was first installed. Only time will tell if this is true, but if it is, that in itself justifies the price tag for me. Oh, and on that chainrub thing, another little trick with the Di2 is autotrim, allowing the front derailleur to shift ever so slightly as you get closer to the outside gears of the cassette, cleverly designed to avoid any chainrub issue that may develop down the line on a mechanical system. It does this automatically, secretly directed from the brain/display, to the front derailleur servo.

For those of you that are weight sensitive, the Di2 XTR is reported to be fractionally lighter than the mechanical version, despite the inclusion of a display unit, junction box and battery. This is achieved through the use of only one shifter, and the fact that the electronic wires are much lighter than the cable equivalents of the mechanical version.

“How long will the battery last?” is a common question. I am told that it is good for at least 300kms, which is more than any stage race I have ridden. If I need more mileage, I simply plug it in to recharge as I would my iPhone. In the unlikely event that I forget to monitor the battery status bar on the display unit and lose battery-life mid-ride, well, people at Shimano far smarter than me have thought about that as well. When the battery runs low, a warning beep will sound that signals enough power for a final shift of the front derailleur. You have about an hour more battery-life left before a second warning beep sounds to signal enough power for a shift of the rear derailleur. And then its single speed baby, until a recharge. If you were worried about not being able to recharge the battery overnight during a multi-stage event, it is easy enough to buy a second battery and slip it into the seatpost. I can’t see that I will need to do this and will probably take a powermonkey rechargeable powersupply with me for an overnight recharge of the Di2 system, just as a precaution.

The verdict

If you can justify spending R35k on a hobby/sport, it is a no-brainer. If you can’t afford that pricetag, wait for the trickle down to XT. From what I have read, that may be as far away as 5 years time, and I personally am not prepared to wait that long. Now that I have it, I would want it more if I didn’t have it, if that makes sense. This is the future, this is bigger than the fad move from 26er to 29er, from tubes to tubeless, from 2/3×10 to 1×11, from seatpost to dropper. In my view, this is the single greatest advance in the sport that I have seen during my time riding. I was way behind the times when it came to the 29er shift, I want to be at the cutting edge of this move.

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Comments

GrantRH

Jun 10, 2015, 9:20 PM

I think I heard the same little birdie. Got a Whatsapp saying Di2 announcement for XT groupset was expected in July.....availability sometime

 

I heard about a recent XT release but thought it was this...

 

https://www.bikehub.co.za/index.php?/topic/149718-Shimano-DEORE-XT-11-speed-and-1x11-option-unveiled

Spoke101

Jun 10, 2015, 10:45 PM

 

Yes that to, and if all goes to plan it will be in SA by the end of the month. :clap:

Shebeen

Jun 11, 2015, 2:35 AM

Nice review.

 

For me it would have to be as bulletproof as JZ's court dodging before I would put it on a mtb. Big statement of xc works cup is getting it in numbers, remember AC just won the giro in manual gears whilst the rest other team were on di2. Just means they do have a choice.

 

I'm interested to see how it handles wild issues like serious mud, or a bent derailleurs hanger

NicoBoshoff

Jun 11, 2015, 4:21 AM

If you knew (and were told by your LBS) that the XT version is coming as soon as say September, would you have waited? I'd be pretty bummed if I forked out R10k more than I had to if I could just have waited a few months.

 

I'm not even sure I'm going for 1x11 XT just yet. My 1x10 setup treated me very well on Sani2C and that's as hard as I'll suffer on that setup, so what will I really be gaining by going 1x11? A bigger chainring? Meh. A bailout gear? Haven't felt the need for one yet.

 

I'll rather wait till I build a new bike (probably next year) and then go across to 11 speed.

Heel Drop

Jun 11, 2015, 5:03 AM

I dont like it when something has limitations. If I want to do the 36one then I should not worry about the battery not making it. I can see a  gap for hub generated power more and more - something that I would def put on my bike for more then one reason 

GrantRH

Jun 11, 2015, 5:19 AM

If you knew (and were told by your LBS) that the XT version is coming as soon as say September, would you have waited? I'd be pretty bummed if I forked out R10k more than I had to if I could just have waited a few months.

 

I'm not even sure I'm going for 1x11 XT just yet. My 1x10 setup treated me very well on Sani2C and that's as hard as I'll suffer on that setup, so what will I really be gaining by going 1x11? A bigger chainring? Meh. A bailout gear? Haven't felt the need for one yet.

 

I'll rather wait till I build a new bike (probably next year) and then go across to 11 speed.

Good question, I'm not sure. When it comes to my road bike I am happy with ultegra mechanical at this stage. My road riding is nothing more than training for off road riding.

 

But when it comes to my MTB, I want the best that I am comfortable to pay for, especially if I'm on the trail for days at a time. With the XTR version I won't get that "should I upgrade to XTR" bug that I sometimes get. Having said that, I have stayed with the XT brakeset, which is good enough for me. I guess it comes down to where I want the best performance from my bike. Weight is less of an issue for me. If I can get the smoothest gear change with the least maintenance, I am willing to pay a premium for that. So I probably would have stuck with XTR if I had the option.

 

Sure the price tag is high. But it was a decision between a new road bike, at twice the price, or the Di2 XTR. My reasoning was that off-road is my first love, by a long way. Road riding is a means to an end. When I am on that trail, in the middle of nowhere, and my new grouppo ticks through the gears effortlessly, I know that I won't be able to wipe that smile off my face. And that makes it worth it to me.

GrantRH

Jun 11, 2015, 5:22 AM

I dont like it when something has limitations. If I want to do the 36one then I should not worry about the battery not making it. I can see a gap for hub generated power more and more - something that I would def put on my bike for more then one reason

I'll update the thread after I get a sense of how long the battery actually lasts. I also expect that battery life will improve significantly as battery technology continues to advance.

 

But for now, I guess it remains a limitation in certain circumstances, and I get the discomfort.

Patchelicious

Jun 11, 2015, 5:23 AM

Hub generators will surely come. With electronic group sets, all our GoPro stuff, electronic suspension bits coming in and all important cell phones... These things will drive a need for hub gennies, and therefore someone will develop one.

PeterF

Jun 11, 2015, 5:40 AM

I'm sorry but you lost me at "R35k".  To me the effort of changing gears with the XT shifters on one bike and the XO shifters on the other is insignificant.

_C50_

Jun 11, 2015, 5:44 AM

Hey, it's not for everyone, I get that.

 

I am not enduro, I focus on multi-stage races. I am not a pro, but I can just crack A group on some races.

 

I can ride rigid, do I have to? No, I like full sus. Do I need padding in my cycling shorts? No, but it's much more comfortable. Could I survive changing punctures on tubes? Yeah, but what a hassle. Can I cycle mechanical rather than electric? Hell yeh, I have done so since I've started. Do I want to go back to mechanical after tasting electric? Not if you paid me. Does that mean I have a soft thumb? Maybe, but it goes well with my soft @ss.

 

Why make life harder when it could be made easier. Embrace advancement, why fight it?

 

I never said you shouldn't go with an electronic group set. In fact, enjoy it and I hope it gives you many hassle free miles. 

 

But to say it's the biggest advancement in cycling since... well, I don't think so. That's also just my opinion. 

 

My mechanical group set doesn't need a 35K "fix". I find that price point absolutely absurd. No matter which way you look at it. 

 

If I ever were to throw that amount of money at a group set, there shouldn't be ANY limitations. It should be set and forget. I sometimes forget to charge my garmin. Now I have to remember to charge another battery. Or carry a spare in case I want to do some ultra endurance event. Just another thing you need to remember to do before you go for a ride, or race. I need less things to worry about, not more of it. 

 

I crash, sometimes. :ph34r:  What happens if you damage the "display unit" in a crash? Will the group set still function? 

Erroli8a8

Jun 11, 2015, 6:16 AM

Technology is coming and coming fast. I am reminded of a saying in a movie "Build it and they will come".

 

bring technology and it will be used, I am one for technology and advancement. all mechanical things are changing to electronic. there are many examples.

 

for me I will change as soon as I have the cash. charging batteries is the least of my worries. I play another sport that is mechanical dominated but there is one manufacturer who has changed to electronic and I love it. (rifle trigger, from mechanical to electronic)

Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

Jun 11, 2015, 6:17 AM

There's a tremendous amount of kool-aid being consumed here...

 

Bigger than tubeless? Carbon frame technology? Dropper? Narrow wide rings? Clutch derailleurs? Thru axles? Hydroforming? Gains in suspension tech? Geometry refinement?

 

Nope. Sorry. It's merely the electrification of a mechanical mechanism. Droppers allowed an on the fly adjustment of the height of your seat. Tubeless allowed the tech of the tires to evolve at a rapid rate, running lower pressures and thus increasing grip in all situations. Narrow wide rings and clutch derailleurs allowed the retention of chains without the use of a chain guide. Suspension tech has revolutionized the way a fully suspended bike behaves on the trails. Carbon fibre tech has allowed for truly wonderful shapes and frame strengths not to mention far lighter parts...

 

Nah. At the moment it's like drive by wire vs normal cable actuated accelerator pedals etc.

GrantRH

Jun 11, 2015, 6:27 AM

I never said you shouldn't go with an electronic group set. In fact, enjoy it and I hope it gives you many hassle free miles.

 

But to say it's the biggest advancement in cycling since... well, I don't think so. That's also just my opinion.

 

My mechanical group set doesn't need a 35K "fix". I find that price point absolutely absurd. No matter which way you look at it.

 

If I ever were to throw that amount of money at a group set, there shouldn't be ANY limitations. It should be set and forget. I sometimes forget to charge my garmin. Now I have to remember to charge another battery. Or carry a spare in case I want to do some ultra endurance event. Just another thing you need to remember to do before you go for a ride, or race. I need less things to worry about, not more of it.

 

I crash, sometimes. :ph34r: What happens if you damage the "display unit" in a crash? Will the group set still function?

All the points you make are good. Trust me, I considered those before forking out a small fortune. As the technology develops some of those concerns will be alleviated. As the technology trickles down, the electric will become much cheaper.

 

The only point I am making is that it certainly makes life easier and riding much more enjoyable, to me at least. The attraction to me is that it is pretty much set and forget, far more so than mechanical, and on a longer term basis. If that means I have to plug it into a socket every couple of months, that is fine with me.

 

And the relatively easy customise-ability on top of that.

 

Looking at the future, I can easily see a world in 5 years time where most mid to top range bikes will come standard with electric. In 7 or so years time I doubt you will be able to buy any new bike with mechanical groupset.

 

Add to that the fact that the system already integrates with shocks, and if the rumours are correct, soon with dropper posts. Now think of a system where your shocks and dropper post anticipate the terrain according to your gear selection. All of this requires little more than a software upgrade. One step further and your gears shift automatically depending on your heart rate to keep you at an ideal level.

 

This is only the start, and from that perspective, it is revolutionary. I can't see it going backwards from here, only forwards.

 

As for a crash affecting the display unit, only time and experience will tell. However, I have often seen countless crashes that damage current mechanical systems, rendering the victims to single speed for the rest of the ride.

Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

Jun 11, 2015, 6:43 AM

It's an evolution, for sure, and for that reason I would embrace it myself. But it is simply not the game changer that it's being portrayed as. Yes, it's good tech. No, it's not the biggest thing in the last 10 years. 

 

Is it bigger than the "change" to niners? Yes. 

jcza

Jun 11, 2015, 6:49 AM

Want!! Hope the price will come down soon. 

 

Also on the list - disc brakes for road bikes. To be introduced next year. 

rouxtjie

Jun 11, 2015, 6:52 AM

ye' old law of diminishing returns....give me standard XT...sits beautifully at the crescent of said graph.

GrantRH

Jun 11, 2015, 7:18 AM

I'm sorry but you lost me at "R35k". To me the effort of changing gears with the XT shifters on one bike and the XO shifters on the other is insignificant.

I personally preferred XO to XT. That is until my groupset lost its crispness over time and the gear shifts were no longer clean, regardless of what tinkering I did.

Steven Knoetze (sk27)

Jun 11, 2015, 7:22 AM

Grant, I think I was the first to ask for this review and I am impressed with the write-up.

Thanks very much.

Makes me excited to see the advancements being made.

There are always complaints that all bikes are starting to look the sameish, and then when something revolutionary comes around everybody gets all bullish about it.

Yes there was nothing wrong with mechanical shifting but the same can be said for many things that have had improvements made. Progress, there's no stopping it.

SRAM adopted the 1x revolution very quickly and everybody asked where Shimano was, well they were developing this obviously.

I see SRAM following suit very soon, if not they will fall behind very quickly.

nox1111

Jun 11, 2015, 7:23 AM

Thanks for the review! Good read!

GrantRH

Jun 11, 2015, 7:31 AM

Grant, I think I was the first to ask for this review and I am impressed with the write-up.

Thanks very much.

Makes me excited to see the advancements being made.

There are always complaints that all bikes are starting to look the sameish, and then when something revolutionary comes around everybody gets all bullish about it.

Yes there was nothing wrong with mechanical shifting but the same can be said for many things that have had improvements made. Progress, there's no stopping it.

SRAM adopted the 1x revolution very quickly and everybody asked where Shimano was, well they were developing this obviously.

I see SRAM following suit very soon, if not they will fall behind very quickly.

 

I heard that SRAM's groupset is designed to be wireless. I also took this into consideration before buying my Di2 XTR. Imagine having to replace or recharge batteries for each component and keeping track of the battery life. That sounds problematic to me. I am a little worried for them that they haven't even introduced the road version yet, so many years after shimano first released its dura-ace. I think they are way behind the curve. That being said, SRAM are very good are introducing something new that people trust almost instantly. 

Terminator

Jun 11, 2015, 7:31 AM

Great review  :thumbup:

 

I'm riding the same set up on my mtb - single shifter on synchroshift - and agree with everything you say. I have customised my S2 setting to change the front ring a little earlier and I'm very happy with it. I rode Sani2C with mine and the battery level indicator dropped one bar (out of 4) for the entire event.

Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

Jun 11, 2015, 7:38 AM

 

 

I heard that SRAM's groupset is designed to be wireless. I also took this into consideration before buying my Di2 XTR. Imagine having to replace or recharge batteries for each component and keeping track of the battery life. That sounds problematic to me. I am a little worried for them that they haven't even introduced the road version yet, so many years after shimano first released its dura-ace. I think they are way behind the curve. That being said, SRAM are very good are introducing something new that people trust almost instantly. 

Correct... But personally, I'd rather have no wires in the gruppo for risk of getting cut. Yes, the chances are minimal, but if you suffer a cut wire somewhere along the line for whatever reason you won't be able to fix it in a hurry... 

 

EDIT: It also gets rid of the problem of trying to find a creative way of hiding the battery in frames that weren't designed with it in mind. 

 

Only question is what sort of protocol it'd be using to convey info between the units. Low Power Bluetooth? 

 

http://roadcyclinguk.com/gear/sram-wireless-electronic-groupset-spotted-womens-tour-flanders.html#sRg8iPiZ7j57UgRh.97

 

http://www.bikeradar.com/road/gear/article/sram-red-wireless-electronic-group-details-discovered-42174/

Patchelicious

Jun 11, 2015, 7:39 AM

It's an evolution, for sure, and for that reason I would embrace it myself. But it is simply not the game changer that it's being portrayed as. Yes, it's good tech. No, it's not the biggest thing in the last 10 years. 

 

Is it bigger than the "change" to niners? Yes. 

Agreed, Di2 is an evolution of a existing system/mechanism. Droppers, Tubeless etc were innovations, not evolutions.

 

Having said that, evolution is good, and is what drive new innovation. Like I said, I think a movement to electro groups will drive innovation for hub generators.

Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

Jun 11, 2015, 7:43 AM

One area Shimano does have the edge is in their control unit's ability to handle instructions on multiple platforms. That's a true benefit in and of itself, but I'm sure SRAM is also going to be doing that in the coming months (if not already)

Pure Savage

Jun 11, 2015, 7:43 AM

I would have thought for MTB a complete wireless system should have been developed from the word go, as that's the biggest weakness off road, one little branch snags your wire and its cut in half and you single speed home.

 

I guess that will be 2.0, just sad they did not do it from the start.

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