Adverse Analytical Finding – SA XCO Champs [July 2013]

Was he a HubSA member?

Hmmm...

I'm all for catching guys and it's great news, but the guys who are doping and are serious about it, won't get caught for anything on race day... I can't remember who said it, but they said failing an in competition test was like failing an IQ test. They need to test the competitive guys in the lead up to the world champs, Cape Epics etc

What makes you think they are not testing the competitive guys in the lead!?

Please give some backing... Or is it because they arn't being caught?

Those who were lapped on Sat51 Ralph Naef (Switzerland)-1 lap52 Paolo Cesar Montoya Cantillo (Costa Rica)-1 lap53 Philip Buys (South Africa)-1 lap54 Max Knox (South Africa)-2 Laps55 Patricio Maximiliano Farias Diaz (Chile)-2 Laps56 Stuart Marais (South Africa)-2 Laps57 Michael Broderick (United States of America)-2 Laps58 Elia Silvestri (Italy)-2 Laps59 José Juan Escarcega (Mexico)-3 Laps60 Heinrich Köhne (Namibia)-3 Laps61 Paul van der Ploeg (Australia)-4 Laps62 Ben Melt Swanepoel (South Africa)-4 Laps63 Sang Hoon Na (Republic of Korea)-4 Laps64 Omer Cumhur Boyraz (Turkey)-4 Laps65 Salih Manavoglu (Turkey)-4 Laps66 Luthando Fatyi (South Africa)-4 Laps67 Tumisang Taabe (Lesotho)-4 Laps68 Phetetso Monese (Lesotho)-5 Laps69 Thuso Makatise (Lesotho)-5 Laps

Is that what it mean, or was he lapped twice by the front riders?

No it means the leader did 2 more laps than he did. in other words if Nino did 7 laps then Max had done 5 when he was pulled off the track.They usually pull off the riders who are going to be lapped before they get lapped to try and prevent them affecting the leaders race, but sometimes it does not work out that way.

Some races in Europe they have someone on a motorbike riding a few minutes in front of the leaders and if he catches up / passes you, you then have to pull off.

2003 world champs in Lugano and I think also at Champrey the guy had a broom tied onto his back aka broom bus style

Here's the pic, taken at 2003 world champs in Lugano

 

2003 world champs in Lugano and I think also at Champrey the guy had a broom tied onto his back aka broom bus style

Cool

Cool

Hijack

Very cool, was the year Mr Min won his first World champs and Ryder Hesjedal was racing Elite MTB for Canada

2 more pics of the downhill course at Lugano, including a Saffa (cannot remember who) riding a Morewood

 

 

Nay worries. I'll happily own my bad days.

 

If someone gets a laugh out of it then that's a bonus :-)

 

If you or Boosted had a GoPro we could have made a whole montage based on 2 hour's riding!

 

As for this thread - if the B sample is positive then throw him out of the sport for good - no license ever again. Or give him a presenting job on Supercycling. Hang on - that's way to cruel!!

He can go to the back of the Q...

Life ban him.......oh well, he is a nobody anyway, so makes no difference.

Either we're really gatvol of this doping ****, or the guy's a real nobody, coz this thread actually ran out after about 2 posts.

What makes you think they are not testing the competitive guys in the lead!?

 

Please give some backing... Or is it because they arn't being caught?

Max Knox lapped on lap 2 WTF, he is not my favorite local rider, but its not like the man can't ride. Wow

He was not lapped on lap two, he was -2 (minus two) laps down on the leaders ... in other words in a seven lap race he was lapped on lap five.

So was Phillip lapped on the first lap? that does not sound right.What is the 80% rule?

The «80 %» rule applies for UCI World Cups (and UCI World Championships) and in events where the organiser has put it

in the specific regulations for the event. This rule allows to withdraw from the course very slow riders, the one that have

a time geater than 80 % from the leader’s time (this 80 % explain the name of the rule!)

The primary reason for withdrawing riders at the 80 % zone is that it decreases the potential for confusion both for the

public and the media in the finish zone area. With the 80 % rule, lapped riders (or riders that are just about to be lapped)

are prevented from crossing the finish line along with the winner of the race.

Reminder: calculating the 80 %

For example, if we expect a race time of 20 minutes per lap, 80 % will be 16 minutes, so as soon as the leader of the race

pass by the 80 % zone, a stop watch is started and all riders passing the 80 % zone more than 16 minutes behind the

leader will be withdrawn from the race.

Except for lapped riders, the 80 % rule does not apply in the final lap, but may need to be applied as early as the first lap

to withdraw very slow riders.

He was not lapped on lap two, he was -2 (minus two) laps down on the leaders ... in other words in a seven lap race he was lapped on lap five.

THANKS

Hijack

Very cool, was the year Mr Min won his first World champs and Ryder Hesjedal was racing Elite MTB for Canada

 

 

was looking at the results from the that year, sam hill and gee atherton were gold and silver in the juniors that year and interesting that Mick Hannah and Peat are the only other active DHer in 2003's top 10 elites

....and Burry was 68th in the junior DH......thats right DH, on a Morewood nogal.

I'm all for catching guys and it's great news, but the guys who are doping and are serious about it, won't get caught for anything on race day... I can't remember who said it, but they said failing an in competition test was like failing an IQ test. They need to test the competitive guys in the lead up to the world champs, Cape Epics etc

They do test the top guys in the lead up to big events ... there is a programme of out-of-competition testing and from what I can gather it is largely driven by the blood passport. They compare the levels from testing and if there is anything suspicious they target those riders, In other words if somebody has a suspicious hematocrit level then he will be targetted. I have heard that that is why they targetted David George (and there are a few other riders in SA who are on the list).

I think the top guys have to give Saids (Wada) a time every day when they know where you are.I think guys will give a time when they know they are normally at home (for example 7-8am in the morning or 9-10pm at night) and then they only update their whereabouts when they are travelling (change their testing time from 7-8am at home to 7-8am at Hotel X near race venue). If the testers come and you are not where you say you are (out having dinner with your girlfriend) you get a black mark -- three black marks and you get an automatic ban. Good system but a pain in the ass for riders I would imagine.

i'm one for testing but must say the system for out of comp testing is a bit like being on parole.....

i'm one for testing but must say the system for out of comp testing is a bit like being on parole.....

I personally feel that out of competition testing is more important than testing on race day.

They do test the top guys in the lead up to big events ... there is a programme of out-of-competition testing and from what I can gather it is largely driven by the blood passport. They compare the levels from testing and if there is anything suspicious they target those riders, In other words if somebody has a suspicious hematocrit level then he will be targetted. I have heard that that is why they targetted David George (and there are a few other riders in SA who are on the list).

 

I think the top guys have to give Saids (Wada) a time every day when they know where you are.I think guys will give a time when they know they are normally at home (for example 7-8am in the morning or 9-10pm at night) and then they only update their whereabouts when they are travelling (change their testing time from 7-8am at home to 7-8am at Hotel X near race venue). If the testers come and you are not where you say you are (out having dinner with your girlfriend) you get a black mark -- three black marks and you get an automatic ban. Good system but a pain in the ass for riders I would imagine.

The thing is, for 2012 we have 200 tests for cycling over the entire year, maybe it has gone up for 2013, but for now lets assume things are relatively similiar... 200 test goes how far exactly?

You talk about a blood passport etc, but that's not so much the case here I am afraid, it's one thing for Chris Froome, but quite a different kettle of fish here in SA. We probably have a 100 professional cyclists in SA between road and mtb? So two tests a year for them?

But wait, what about the podium tests for every major race in SA - lets be conservative and say 15 races, and a min of three tests per race - that's 45 off the 200. Then we have testing at Nationals for all levels, road and mtb, and then even just the odd provincial - I think we can take off another 60/70 tests? Then surely the regular race winners on the road and mtb circuits should get tested a bit more regularly? Lets say 10 riders getting 5 tests a year?

We're now down to 30/40 tests (and quite possibly even less) to share out between 80/90 elite cyclists? And I also haven't even touched the Vets racing scene. And you want to talk about a Riders passport? It's all good for PR and to convince sponsors etc, but it's not much more than that quite frankly...

I applaud SAIDS for what they do and it is getting better, but it's frankly nowhere near being convincing for me.

I personally feel that out of competition testing is more important than testing on race day.

I agree. Not being a doper myself, I would assume that the dope is being used to gain an edge or take your physique to the next level so to speak. (Stating the obvious I know...) but that edge gained during training in the off season can surely be maintained during competition?

Should boil down to natural talent and genetics along with hard work and training.

I agree. Not being a doper myself, I would assume that the dope is being used to gain an edge or take your physique to the next level so to speak. (Stating the obvious I know...) but that edge gained during training in the off season can surely be maintained during competition?

 

Should boil down to natural talent and genetics along with hard work and training.

I agree. Not being a doper myself, I would assume that the dope is being used to gain an edge or take your physique to the next level so to speak. (Stating the obvious I know...) but that edge gained during training in the off season can surely be maintained during competition?

 

Should boil down to natural talent and genetics along with hard work and training.

When I talk about those two things people become highly offended.

So I wont go there.

Let's just assume that hard training is all it take, and drugs of course.

Is alcohol not considered a performance enhancer in downhill

No.

It is considered a recovery drink.

Edit: Ask Iron and Eldron....

When I talk about those two things people become highly offended.

So I wont go there.

Let's just assume that hard training is all it take, and drugs of course.

Hard work and training will get you in the game. Talent and genetics will let you rise to the top. Doping will get you 7 Tdf titles........

With enough gym time and juice you'll probably get Chris Froome an MMA fight, but let's be honest, the chances of him wearing a championship belt are pretty slim....

He was not lapped on lap two, he was -2 (minus two) laps down on the leaders ... in other words in a seven lap race he was lapped on lap five.

I see it that he finished lap 5 after the leaders finished their final lap. So the leaders passed him twice on the course of which the last time would probably have been on lap five, but the first time would have been on lap 3 if I have to guess, unless he had mechanicals on lap 5 and was stuck there while the leaders did 2 laps.

Hijack

Very cool, was the year Mr Min won his first World champs and Ryder Hesjedal was racing Elite MTB for Canada

 

2 more pics of the downhill course at Lugano, including a Saffa (cannot remember who) riding a Morewood

 

 

 

 

was looking at the results from the that year, sam hill and gee atherton were gold and silver in the juniors that year and interesting that Mick Hannah and Peat are the only other active DHer in 2003's top 10 elites

 

....and Burry was 68th in the junior DH......thats right DH, on a Morewood nogal.

Looking at the photos of Greg that year, he was still a laatie in 2003

The unknown rider in my photo is on a Morewood, looks a bit big for Burry tho

Didn't Burry also ride XC that year, I remember speaking to him and his dad in the pits at the time and thought he was doing both XC and DH...he used to do both in SA but might be wrong for this event.

 

With enough gym time and juice you'll probably get Chris Froome an MMA fight, but let's be honest, the chances of him wearing a championship belt are pretty slim....

They may be good in actual fact, check how skinny he is... his opponent must have bloody good aim to make contact